olisharp
Some of my tunes are louder than others and I would like VDJ to play them all at the same perceived volume. ReplayGain in Winamp does a great job of this but I'm having mixed results with VDJ. I've read the instructions for VDJ's settings regarding gain (v5rev6) and I'm not sure if I should use "always0dB" or "always match". At the moment I'm thinking I should use "always match".
Does anyone know:
When VDJ analyses a song, does it calculate values for some kind of RMS normalisation?
Does VDJ use ReplayGain algorithyms?
Does VDJ support / read ReplayGain values stored in the ID3v2 tags when calculated by programs such as Winamp?
Does anyone have views on the "MP3Gain" software?
Any help here would be greatly appreciated as this uncertainty is making me nervous about playing on big systems where the differences are really obvious!
Cheers, Oli.
Does anyone know:
When VDJ analyses a song, does it calculate values for some kind of RMS normalisation?
Does VDJ use ReplayGain algorithyms?
Does VDJ support / read ReplayGain values stored in the ID3v2 tags when calculated by programs such as Winamp?
Does anyone have views on the "MP3Gain" software?
Any help here would be greatly appreciated as this uncertainty is making me nervous about playing on big systems where the differences are really obvious!
Cheers, Oli.
Posted Sat 19 Apr 08 @ 8:54 am
olisharp
Well, it's nice to know you guys have so much to say and are so eager to help out when someone actually has a challenging question.
Incidentally, Serato uses a very sophisticated RMS normalizer to make sure all your tunes are played back at the same volume, and they are quick to tell you this as well. Not too hard to see why Serato is at the top of the tree. If you're serious about sounding good, I suggest looking in this direction.
Incidentally, Serato uses a very sophisticated RMS normalizer to make sure all your tunes are played back at the same volume, and they are quick to tell you this as well. Not too hard to see why Serato is at the top of the tree. If you're serious about sounding good, I suggest looking in this direction.
Posted Fri 09 May 08 @ 9:29 am
Tim Bennett
Easy man, you only asked 30 minutes ago. This isn't a fully staffed Techinical Support site, it's a forum for the users to share info. But, I'm sure someone here will have input soon. Here is mine.
VDJ will auto adust the gain to an extent, check in your config and make sure this option is enabled. Sorry I can't tell you the exact setting to check, I'm at work now. There are also several programs available that will scan your files and reset the volume to your liking. I don't use the software so I don't know the names right off hand. Maybe use the search bar and see what you can find. I know this has been discussed recently.
Don't get frustrated, this is a very good forum, great community with lots of knowledgable folks eager to help.
Good luck.
VDJ will auto adust the gain to an extent, check in your config and make sure this option is enabled. Sorry I can't tell you the exact setting to check, I'm at work now. There are also several programs available that will scan your files and reset the volume to your liking. I don't use the software so I don't know the names right off hand. Maybe use the search bar and see what you can find. I know this has been discussed recently.
Don't get frustrated, this is a very good forum, great community with lots of knowledgable folks eager to help.
Good luck.
Posted Fri 09 May 08 @ 10:17 am
DJ-ALF
olisharp wrote :
Some of my tunes are louder than others and I would like VDJ to play them all at the same perceived volume. ReplayGain in Winamp does a great job of this but I'm having mixed results with VDJ. I've read the instructions for VDJ's settings regarding gain (v5rev6) and I'm not sure if I should use "always0dB" or "always match". At the moment I'm thinking I should use "always match".
Does anyone know:
When VDJ analyses a song, does it calculate values for some kind of RMS normalisation?
Does VDJ use ReplayGain algorithyms?
Does VDJ support / read ReplayGain values stored in the ID3v2 tags when calculated by programs such as Winamp?
Does anyone have views on the "MP3Gain" software?
Any help here would be greatly appreciated as this uncertainty is making me nervous about playing on big systems where the differences are really obvious!
Cheers, Oli.
Does anyone know:
When VDJ analyses a song, does it calculate values for some kind of RMS normalisation?
Does VDJ use ReplayGain algorithyms?
Does VDJ support / read ReplayGain values stored in the ID3v2 tags when calculated by programs such as Winamp?
Does anyone have views on the "MP3Gain" software?
Any help here would be greatly appreciated as this uncertainty is making me nervous about playing on big systems where the differences are really obvious!
Cheers, Oli.
Hi
You should use "Always 0dB" option, it is better. What version do you use? Latest 5.0.7 Pro has good autogain + some new options. There is still some tracks that it plays louder, but the Team is aware of the problem and is working on it.
Posted Fri 09 May 08 @ 11:24 am
Caliente123
You have to level all your songs. Use this software to change your format between WMA, Mp3 etc and it has a setting for you to level all your songs. I have it set to peak level 95 % . even though my music was MP3 format. I used the software to do from mp3 to mp3 and Normalize level to 95 %...
http://www.nch.com.au/switch/index.html This is the link.. Its free to use
http://www.nch.com.au/switch/index.html This is the link.. Its free to use
Posted Fri 09 May 08 @ 11:38 am
olisharp
Sorry if I seemed a bit cross, I was, after 3 weeks and thousands of ppl reading it and no help, but it's all cool now!
Ok, nice to finally have some feedback, so thanks for posting. Also nice to know I'm not the only one having issues with this!
It's version 5.07, but it's at this club I play at so I can't really do updates on it or change the settings too much.
I've also found always 0dB works much better, as previously mentioned.
Regarding levelling all your tunes, I had been using MP3 Gain, but don't really have that much faith in free software. Then I found "Platinum Notes" from the guys who develpped "Mixed In Key". It's not free but it is amazing. Version 2 is coming soon so hold out for that before paying as there's no free upgrade. I promise I'm not on their promo team, but I really love what it does to mp3s. I mostly get mp3s from Beatport and, frankly, think they sound a bit shit (small dynamic range, and sound like they're clipping) compared to well mastered vinyl, or even vinyl of the exact same tune.
Running a back-2-back test in VDJ with the original Beatport tune on the blue deck and the Platinum Notes processed tune on the Red deck, the difference is staggering, really.
Can't wait for a VDJ update with some slicker gain algorithms, as this is the only thing putting me off VDJ at the moment. That and the new loop interface, personally think 3.4 was perfect in that respect, but that's another issue, (as is VDJ's onternal mixer)!
So yeah, thanks for your opinions. If anyone else reading this is stuck, try Platinum Notes, and wait for VDJ5.08.
Ok, nice to finally have some feedback, so thanks for posting. Also nice to know I'm not the only one having issues with this!
It's version 5.07, but it's at this club I play at so I can't really do updates on it or change the settings too much.
I've also found always 0dB works much better, as previously mentioned.
Regarding levelling all your tunes, I had been using MP3 Gain, but don't really have that much faith in free software. Then I found "Platinum Notes" from the guys who develpped "Mixed In Key". It's not free but it is amazing. Version 2 is coming soon so hold out for that before paying as there's no free upgrade. I promise I'm not on their promo team, but I really love what it does to mp3s. I mostly get mp3s from Beatport and, frankly, think they sound a bit shit (small dynamic range, and sound like they're clipping) compared to well mastered vinyl, or even vinyl of the exact same tune.
Running a back-2-back test in VDJ with the original Beatport tune on the blue deck and the Platinum Notes processed tune on the Red deck, the difference is staggering, really.
Can't wait for a VDJ update with some slicker gain algorithms, as this is the only thing putting me off VDJ at the moment. That and the new loop interface, personally think 3.4 was perfect in that respect, but that's another issue, (as is VDJ's onternal mixer)!
So yeah, thanks for your opinions. If anyone else reading this is stuck, try Platinum Notes, and wait for VDJ5.08.
Posted Wed 21 May 08 @ 8:43 pm
djderricke
Also don't forget with Beatport the tracks are mastered (and in some cases not very well.) by the creators of the track. Sound quality will vary wildly depending on the track.
Posted Wed 21 May 08 @ 9:12 pm
DJ-ALF
olisharp wrote :
It's version 5.07, but it's at this club I play at so I can't really do updates on it or change the settings too much.
How about entering your serial in your profile? Or you are using Demo version in a club for more then a year? ;)
olisharp wrote :
If anyone else reading this is stuck, try Platinum Notes, and wait for VDJ5.08.
Another benefit for going Pro, you will have next update for free.
Posted Thu 22 May 08 @ 7:45 am
olisharp
DJ Alf,
I appreciate your concern as I\'m not a big fan of free-loaders myself. I understand that paying for software = more money for development = better software! I also think that people who get paid for DJing, but won\'t pay for their tools (software / music) really should question their motives.
I, personally, only have VDJ Console Edition as that\'s all I need for home use with my Hercules mk2, so that\'s all I have regsitered! I don\'t use my laptop at the club, there\'s a desktop in the booth so I just rock up with my hard drive and some vinyl. I wouldn\'t expect them to let me privately enjoy the benefits of their serial number, so I haven\'t asked for it, and it remains the production manager\'s closely guarded secret!
Back to volume levels:
I\'m not sure if VDJ uses peak or mean level analysis, but I\'m of the understanding that mean produces more consistent results in a club environment, whereas you\'d probably want peak for Hi-Fi use to retain the song\'s dynamic range, rather than sounding bad-ass at 3am on a Saturday morning!
Platinum Notes definately does mean level analysis though. (Mean as in mean-average, not as in it\'ll steal your kids\' icecream!)
As for the quality of mastering on Beatport, I agree that it really can be a bit shocking!
It\'s certainly true that there has been an ongoing volume war within the Drum & Bass camp for several years, with each artist understandably wanting his latest tune to sound more banging than anything else (banging tunes = cash in the pocket).
Sadly this is more easily achieved through heavy compression with cheap VST plugins than careful production skills and long hours in the studio ( the jump-up crew seem the most guilty, although I can\'t deny their stuff does the business for the ravers!). And it shows in the results. The guys who take 9 months and 50 different basslines to arrive at the finished product (one song) get respected and their tunes have long lives. The guys who bosh out 3 tunes a week, here today gone tomorrow!
That\'s why I\'ve got so much respect for the Min-Tech crowd. There\'s so much precision in those sounds cos they can\'t hide behind 19 diferent layers of synthesiser and hope no-one\'ll notice cos their tunes only get played for 3 minutes anyway.
All this could just be some over-the-top complaining though. Most people don\'t notice clipped hi-hats when they\'re off their faces at the weekend. I also think DJing\'s about crafting a vibe, and as such tunes could be considered just a means to an end.
But things are getting better as the technology progresses, which brings me nicely back to Virtual DJ. It\'s so good to see that the team listen to users\' concerns and act on them. The sheer amount of versions and revisions is testament to that! I also think it\'s great that we get the developments as they happen, rather than having to wait years between each release.
So thankyou VDJ team, and also everyone using VDJ, testing it to its limits and providing some worthwhile feedback.
I appreciate your concern as I\'m not a big fan of free-loaders myself. I understand that paying for software = more money for development = better software! I also think that people who get paid for DJing, but won\'t pay for their tools (software / music) really should question their motives.
I, personally, only have VDJ Console Edition as that\'s all I need for home use with my Hercules mk2, so that\'s all I have regsitered! I don\'t use my laptop at the club, there\'s a desktop in the booth so I just rock up with my hard drive and some vinyl. I wouldn\'t expect them to let me privately enjoy the benefits of their serial number, so I haven\'t asked for it, and it remains the production manager\'s closely guarded secret!
Back to volume levels:
I\'m not sure if VDJ uses peak or mean level analysis, but I\'m of the understanding that mean produces more consistent results in a club environment, whereas you\'d probably want peak for Hi-Fi use to retain the song\'s dynamic range, rather than sounding bad-ass at 3am on a Saturday morning!
Platinum Notes definately does mean level analysis though. (Mean as in mean-average, not as in it\'ll steal your kids\' icecream!)
As for the quality of mastering on Beatport, I agree that it really can be a bit shocking!
It\'s certainly true that there has been an ongoing volume war within the Drum & Bass camp for several years, with each artist understandably wanting his latest tune to sound more banging than anything else (banging tunes = cash in the pocket).
Sadly this is more easily achieved through heavy compression with cheap VST plugins than careful production skills and long hours in the studio ( the jump-up crew seem the most guilty, although I can\'t deny their stuff does the business for the ravers!). And it shows in the results. The guys who take 9 months and 50 different basslines to arrive at the finished product (one song) get respected and their tunes have long lives. The guys who bosh out 3 tunes a week, here today gone tomorrow!
That\'s why I\'ve got so much respect for the Min-Tech crowd. There\'s so much precision in those sounds cos they can\'t hide behind 19 diferent layers of synthesiser and hope no-one\'ll notice cos their tunes only get played for 3 minutes anyway.
All this could just be some over-the-top complaining though. Most people don\'t notice clipped hi-hats when they\'re off their faces at the weekend. I also think DJing\'s about crafting a vibe, and as such tunes could be considered just a means to an end.
But things are getting better as the technology progresses, which brings me nicely back to Virtual DJ. It\'s so good to see that the team listen to users\' concerns and act on them. The sheer amount of versions and revisions is testament to that! I also think it\'s great that we get the developments as they happen, rather than having to wait years between each release.
So thankyou VDJ team, and also everyone using VDJ, testing it to its limits and providing some worthwhile feedback.
Posted Mon 26 May 08 @ 3:29 pm
radiofc
@olisharp - did you have any joy since your last post? I find that the home edition of VDJ for Hercules MK2 works okay with mp3gain but cannot get the pro edition of the S/W to work the same way - it\'s really frustrating because I love a lot of the new features in VDJ but am not comfortable gigging with it while it is like that...
Posted Thu 05 Jun 08 @ 6:20 am
olisharp
Radio FC
Sorry to hear you're having problems too, I feel your pain!
I haven't really experimented since I got Platinum Notes as this has pretty much solved all my problems. It does a really good job of standardising the perceived loudness of tunes (how loud they sound) and also somehow makes mp3s sound more substantial on club systems, so you'll no longer feel a bit embarassed about playing them!
With Platinum Notes processed tunes, I use "always 0dB" in the settings for VDJ.
I can't remember where I've written this, but you really can't expect too much from free software (mp3gain). The idea's good but the implementation is a little lacking. An important point to grasp is the diference between "mean" and "peak" normalisation. I found Wikipedia quite helpful for this.
So, my advice would be to get Platinum Notes. I think they're on version 2 now. You can email them a couple of tunes to process by way of a demo, so send them a couple of tunes that are a bit quiet, and some that are a bit "over mastered" (maybe from Beatport haha) and compare what they send you back. BUT, do your critical listening on the loudest speakers you have access to. I've found Platinum Notes is only really beneficial when using big systems (the originals seem to have more dynamic range and clarity on a Hi-Fi system)
I've asked many times about how VDJ handles this issue, and have never received a convincing reply. "Work In Progress" seems to be the official word!
Oh and by the way, I've also found that using the club's mixer (rather than the EQs and faders on Hercules) is the flavour! So really I'm just using Hercules / VDJ as a player, and the club mixer to do all the mixing. Try it!
I noticed that the EQs on Hercules don't actually do anything between the 9 o'clock and "full kill / infinity cut" positions (7 o'clock) and are not smooth, gradual or progressive at all when turning them up from infinity cut. This is why I tried running VDJ through a hardware mixer (been using Xone 92s a lot lately) and I haven't looked back since!
To Conclude:
Give Platinum Notes a try.
Hercules is fine for House Parties, but not for clubs. Try using the in-house hardware mixer. (you'll only need to take 1 extra phono lead)
Hope it works out for you!
Sorry to hear you're having problems too, I feel your pain!
I haven't really experimented since I got Platinum Notes as this has pretty much solved all my problems. It does a really good job of standardising the perceived loudness of tunes (how loud they sound) and also somehow makes mp3s sound more substantial on club systems, so you'll no longer feel a bit embarassed about playing them!
With Platinum Notes processed tunes, I use "always 0dB" in the settings for VDJ.
I can't remember where I've written this, but you really can't expect too much from free software (mp3gain). The idea's good but the implementation is a little lacking. An important point to grasp is the diference between "mean" and "peak" normalisation. I found Wikipedia quite helpful for this.
So, my advice would be to get Platinum Notes. I think they're on version 2 now. You can email them a couple of tunes to process by way of a demo, so send them a couple of tunes that are a bit quiet, and some that are a bit "over mastered" (maybe from Beatport haha) and compare what they send you back. BUT, do your critical listening on the loudest speakers you have access to. I've found Platinum Notes is only really beneficial when using big systems (the originals seem to have more dynamic range and clarity on a Hi-Fi system)
I've asked many times about how VDJ handles this issue, and have never received a convincing reply. "Work In Progress" seems to be the official word!
Oh and by the way, I've also found that using the club's mixer (rather than the EQs and faders on Hercules) is the flavour! So really I'm just using Hercules / VDJ as a player, and the club mixer to do all the mixing. Try it!
I noticed that the EQs on Hercules don't actually do anything between the 9 o'clock and "full kill / infinity cut" positions (7 o'clock) and are not smooth, gradual or progressive at all when turning them up from infinity cut. This is why I tried running VDJ through a hardware mixer (been using Xone 92s a lot lately) and I haven't looked back since!
To Conclude:
Give Platinum Notes a try.
Hercules is fine for House Parties, but not for clubs. Try using the in-house hardware mixer. (you'll only need to take 1 extra phono lead)
Hope it works out for you!
Posted Sun 06 Jul 08 @ 8:29 am
radiofc
@olisharp - thanks a lot for all the excellent info. I will investigate Platinum Notes. It sounds the business. Cheers, Shane
Posted Fri 08 Aug 08 @ 9:12 am