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Forum: General Discussion

Topic: Nobody mixes live anymore

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I know a lot of DJs - none of them are mixing standard tracks anymore.
With modern software, more DJs are taking on the role of a producer and remixing songs on their own then spinning them in the clubs.

VDJ needs to capitalize on this market big time. This is the direction DJs are going in.
Its getting to the point where nobody cares if you're using time codes anymore - controllers are gaining popularity because they are a helpful tool to those who remix and mashup tracks.

I would love more than anything to see Virtual DJ re-brand itself by coming out with a new product for remixing. I've always hated the name Virtual DJ - the word "virtual" is often associated with the words "fake", "emulation" and "not the real thing". This sort of de-values the DJ. A name change and remixing tools would be brilliant for the next version.
 
Posted Sun 06 Nov 11 @ 4:33 pm
It doesn't need a name change. The word (in computer tech) means "created by means of a computer", so the name is accurate - the DJ is using a simulation of DJ hardware.

I do agree to an extent about having some more production friendly features though...

Warping of tracks a la Ableton Live would be very cool, as would better sampler functionality.

And yes, people do mix live - I've heard them!
 
I've been told countless times that I am a hack because I'm using VDJ which has "auto sync" which I don't even use.
Funny thing is that I'm being told I'm a hack by people who cut 45 minute long mashups then go out and play them in the clubs without mixing between tracks. Same thing as having someone elses mix cd playing. I guess it's nearly impossible to get this done live with programs like Serato and VDJ however I have actually seen someone mix live mashups with Abelton.

The product has a bad reputation so I think rebranding will help. Software DJing is owned by Serato but with the gaining popularity of controllers I think Atomix has a good chance at being the leader in this area. The use of a controller is best when you're working on remixes and right now, a lot of DJ's are doing their mixes at home on a program like Abelton Live then playing them in clubs. None of it is live.

I shouldn't say that NOBODY mixes live anymore but there is a growing number of DJs who do all their creative work at home so it's perfect then they play that mix live.
 
I call them lab dj's and all of their sets sound the same.
The only salvation is the big boys travel cross town, cross country even worldwide so few hear it twice.

Just remember this, when you're on top you have to anticipate people will take shots at you.
If you let it get to you, you've failed.

Did Chrysler re-brand?
Hell no, they dug in for the long haul and improved their products under the original name and they were going broke, Atomix is not.
And that is exactly what the business model has been for Atomix after Atomix Mp3 came and went, make it better and they have.

Rule #1 in business, if you change your identity you are starting over.
Word spreading would sound like "same software different name, color, interface", so basically you look weak so whats the gain...
Look what happened to Coca Cola.

Look at the ratio of dj's from the noobs all the way up that are buying dj software.
If I had to guess, the ration would be 80% mobile to 20% club.
Serato confirms this by introducing two software's to compete with um...oh ya...Virtual Dj that software that devalues the dj because it's a "fake", "emulation" and "not the real thing" lol.

The value of a dj should be based on what he does in his sets, not what software he is using.
After you've had a couple of people or club owners come up with wowsers after your set, none of the nonsense matters.

Every set I play is on the fly mixing in key on beat cutting and blending the tracks.
I never know what I am going to play before I start the set.
I don't use Serato for good reasons which come from their users many of which are friends also.

r
 
groovindj wrote :
It doesn't need a name change. The word (in computer tech) means "created by means of a computer", so the name is accurate - the DJ is using a simulation of DJ hardware.



Even thou you are correct about the definition of the word, it's often not what the word really means, but what people "think" of it.

Examples

Mustang
Jaguar
Impala


What came to your mind? vehicles? or animals? More than likely people associate Mustang with a muscle car not with a Horse.

The word "virtual" does make most people think of "fake" or "almost real" as in "virtual reality".

It does sound as if it's "almost as good as the real thing"

So, I do agree with the name change. But that's for Marketing to worry about.

As far as others thinking you're a hack for using this or that, do what the rest of us do, ignore these people and make yourself successful.

I use the Sync button almost 90% of the time, as well as the rest of the buttons VDJ has to offer.

The thousands of listeners who keep coming back to the web-radio I DJ at is proof that they don't care how you do it.
 
I guess all I'm asking for is a more robust application. Something that applies more to the modern DJ.
I feel like standard DJing and mixing on video is so 2009. lol
I'd like to see a program that does DJing and music production on 1 program. That way I can take advantage of the time codes I use and the digital controller I already have.
If they were to do that - calling it something else would make sense because it's really a completely different product at that point.
 
interesting. i mix live every night we're open and have only once or twice wanted or even tried to do production. mostly because i still have bad memories of my days in radio and having to produce ads under mind breaking timelines for people who wanted monster production on micro budgets.
there's already enough production going on, and my customers want the song they hear on the radio or watch on tv. playing a remix is iffy at best and usually generates a complaint or two or just clears the floor.

also if i didnt mix live i'd get fired, but thats besides the point.
 
DJ'ing is really not about software or hardware, but more about brainware.

You have to be able to read the crowd, and identify what (music) it takes to make them have a good time.

If you suck at that, you can buy all the gear you want, you will still suck
 
SevanKambel wrote :
I've been told countless times that I am a hack because I'm using VDJ which has "auto sync"


The people telling you that are ignorant muppets.

They seem to think VDJ "mixes for you", and takes away the control of DJing manually.

Chances are they've never tried VDJ but just heard it's rubbish "because it has sync", so they carry on the Chinese Whisper.

When I hear or see one of those comments, I always say: "Sync is an option, not a requirement"
 
There are more and more Dj's looking at Virtual Dj because of what it does already.

In the SSL forum there is a discussion begging for options, options that Virtual Dj already has.
So the curious would begin to wonder why, not be offended by it.
Most of it is talk that builds their ego's up as masters of the art because its Serato.

When this very misdemeanor reason of sync for disliking the software came up I stepped into it because it became the main focus of the hating.

Quote :
When people asked for options I never said a word, I respect this forum and it's staff.

I just wish people would open their eyes a bit and stop the hating nonsense.

My car has a cigarette lighter in it, I hate it, it makes me look like a smoker and that's not me at all. I could let it go, but I can't, so I am forever committed to hate on that car company despite the fact that its a Corvette with all the options.

It's not the software, its what you do with it that matters.

out


And to that came a long but robust reply from a local club dj who I totally respect, and its his first and last line that brings my point of this long rant to a point.

Quote :
I cant use VDJ becuase my wife will make fun of me....

I taught her how to use it in under 3 hours.
so, whenever she "offers" up my DJ services for her friends neices graduation party,
I say here's the eons; heres a copy of the hard drive.... have fun.
and she always gives me shit now because of how easy it was, is....

Like mentioned above, it all depends on what ya do with it, and preference.
I know guys on VDJ who are amazing... though, they are in the the low %.
fact is, most of the guys I know using VDJ are the hacks...
(thats a fact that the "few guys i know" are hacks....not that I know everyone is)

Its funny Rick mentioned the cars.
Thats the same anaology I always goto... when CDJs came out, and there was the
are u CDJ or Vinyl... Id always say both...
why?
Well of someone said... you can have this cherry 63 Vette, or this 2011 Vette..
well, Id want both.... who says I cant have (use) both...DJ Law?

So, when I look at DVS I personally, IMO, think VDJ on most levels is a consumer grade sports car... like a mustang maybe?
anyone can go buy it, and if you have driven enough cars you be able to street race it pretty well and look flashy.... and its certainly a ballsy car, worthy of its pricetag.

but I wouldnt Take it on a Formula race track where those cars are designed to do
one thing, race on professional race tracks against other drivers.

and Ill tell ya, theres days i WISH i had VDJ on my computer.... weddings.
I still mix my dinner sets live...or its slow and I just want 4 tracks to play so I
can talk to the manager/bartender...and not have to stop, run to the booth, mix the next record...."okay...where were we?"

not to get off topic... and start yet another VDJ /SLL debate....
thats just my opinion, and I started out on VDJ with video, and have always kept up
with their progress, they have certainly made moves....good ones.
but fact is "joe public" knows serato.. "jimmy raver" knows traktor.
and they both know VDJ becuase they have it on their computers at home...
and if they have it.... well... you see where Im going.. "if i have it, and im not even a dj"

but in the end...I just can have my wife talking shit about my DVS to me.


And in the final back and forth was this exchange.

Quote :

So, when I look at DVS I personally, IMO, think VDJ on most levels is a consumer grade sports car... like a mustang maybe?



You mean Shelby..hehe and keep an eye on the rear view mirror...lol
 
I mix standard videos and remix videos 'live' every night at my residencies. I never plan what I am going to play, it starts out fairly random and customer requests can completely change the course of the music. Every night is different. I beatmix videos for around 80% of the night.

A couple of weeks ago I had a customer come up and ask where could she get hold of this remix I was playing. I said you can't get it anywhere 'cos I am doing it 'live' everytime you hear it lol. I play it quite regularly and have done for several years along with some other remixes I do on the fly.

I use Smartplay extensively, then pitch reset after the mix. They are tools to be used. I cannot understand anyone not using the tools provided because it's not considered 'cool'. Does anybody really care??? Oh yes, only other DJs or wannabe DJs, the audience are only interested what comes out of the speakers.

Here is an analogy; would you dig a trench with a shovel manually when there is a mechanical digger available? I think not. I've heard this argument for 13 years since I started using computers to DJ with, it's getting a bit tired and tedious now.

So, am I not 'a real DJ'? Hmmmm, I'm the one standing mixing for 4 hours with the place jumping and getting paid handsomely for it. I do this for a living, no day job, no government handouts. Maybe I'm just 'a VirtualDJ' lol.

P.S. I've DJed 35 years and can mix vinyl by ear without beat counters. Still have my 1210s setup ready to play at home, but, never touched them in several years. Think maybe I should sell them now.
 
Do you have smart play activated all night?

You would be at the same bpm all night! your audience must get that mono tone effect where you cant here anything other than a constant 128 bpm beat.

Try breaking the monotheism every 3rd song.
 
No, after 35 years DJing I'm not that daft lol.

You should re-read my post, I use smart play when mixing and, as I mentioned, use pitch reset after the mix to take the track to its correct bpm. Then I may use smart play to bring in the next track, then pitch reset if needed after the mix. I also switch smart play on and off depending on the tracks to be mixed i.e. if the bpm's are too far apart 120 to 128 for instance. Not everything is at 128 bpm. I play everything from 90bpm RnB to 150bpm Rave. My whole night is a roller coaster range of bpm's.

I use the MC6000 and DJ Formatt's Mixlab4. Shift and Play button toggles the Smartplay on and off, nice and simple. I have re-programmed the Shift Vinyl button for the jog wheels to be Pitch Reset. On Mixlab4 skin you can see the smart play lock next to the play button onscreen.

One of my residency gigs is Rock and Indie where smart play is never used for that type of music. But for my Nightclub gigs, keeping the dance floor beat going it's great, when used properly.
 
Let you of then.
 
Gee thanks lol.
 
lstroem wrote :
DJ'ing is really not about software or hardware, but more about brainware.


amen.
 
I found a way to mix and mashup live: I use Sync, Auto-play, Auto-cue (but I do manually adjust key.. VDJ doesn't always get it right). Back i nthe old days, mashups were pretty much back and forth between two vinyls, lots of scratching and cutting.

Now? A whole new world is opened up. Without having to worry about pitch or key, I can fire off 4 tracks simultaneously, cut between dozens of cues, add cool effects to blend in and out various a'capellas, and really make something unique. If I had to worry about beatmatching and my reaction time to fire off cues precisely in time, I would not be able to create live.

I have reconfigured my VDJ so that it acts similar to Ableton. I use ALL 99 Tracks, and setup a monome, APC40 and 20 to fire everything. Pick your poison, but doing this with VDJ lets me mix on the fly rather than setup my mixes before hand as in Ableton.

One thing I have found it that it is alot of work. I only have two hands. I can't duplicate all of those simultaneous effects that most club songs have. So, I need to rely on some automation.

Someone else here did mention an important fact. Let's say 80% djs are mobile. Mobile dj's going through this involved live mixing will probably clear the floor, as you can mash up all night when folks probably want to hear radio-friendly or well known songs, most are not club anyways.

I don't agree with playing pre-recorded SETS (vs. prerecorded mixes or mashups). If you have a 30 minute set and your crowd is dying 10 minutes into it, you gotta go back to live mixing. Doesn't always work.
 
i disagree wit you on this one! cause i live dj i don't record my mixes till this day, unless someone ask me to burn they a mix! cause i want every mix to be fresh and new!
 
I been mixing live from the time I started mixing and there are plenty DJ's who still mix live to this day. As for people prerecording, there is nothing wrong with it, if you're a producer! If you're a DJ, you're mixing on the spot. There is nothing wrong with being prepared, but that doesn't mean using prerecorded mixes or another DJ's mashup you got from a record pool is cool, WRONG ANSWER!

Honestly where is the fun in it, if you're not mixing live? Your creativity lies within you, be bold enough to be different and move the crowd with your own style and not someone else!
 


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