Mr DJ Mel
Hi folks,
This one has been of a big bear for me for a long while and was wondering if someone may know the answer.
I pretty much always use my RX in RX mode (external mixer) instead of midi (internal mixer) mode.
The thing is the is huge sound level difference in output volume when using VDJ in external mode rather then internal. I don’t really want to go into the reasons why I prefer external, but surely this isn’t right?
The output volume of the RX is perfectly fine if not louder when using a USB key. It’s just the is a huge volume level difference when using it in MIDI external mode.
It’s to the point I actually have to use a separate small mixer to get the desired output I need to drive my PA system.
I have tried this with both my MacBook and W10 laptops and it’s the same on both so it not obviously a laptop issue. It’s either the RX itself or VDJ limiting the output in external mode.
Any help is truly appreciated.
Mel
This one has been of a big bear for me for a long while and was wondering if someone may know the answer.
I pretty much always use my RX in RX mode (external mixer) instead of midi (internal mixer) mode.
The thing is the is huge sound level difference in output volume when using VDJ in external mode rather then internal. I don’t really want to go into the reasons why I prefer external, but surely this isn’t right?
The output volume of the RX is perfectly fine if not louder when using a USB key. It’s just the is a huge volume level difference when using it in MIDI external mode.
It’s to the point I actually have to use a separate small mixer to get the desired output I need to drive my PA system.
I have tried this with both my MacBook and W10 laptops and it’s the same on both so it not obviously a laptop issue. It’s either the RX itself or VDJ limiting the output in external mode.
Any help is truly appreciated.
Mel
Posted Tue 23 Nov 21 @ 6:55 pm
Mr DJ Mel
Anyone able to giev any advice on this?
TIA
TIA
Posted Fri 03 Dec 21 @ 4:41 pm
florincj
I have the same problem with the Pioneer DDJ RZ
Posted Sat 04 Dec 21 @ 5:26 pm
PhantomDeejay
This is not a "problem"
It's how the firmware of those devices work.
So, in a nutshell, when using "internal (MIDI)" mode the software is responsible for the entire range of the sound interface of the device, which also means that the software is responsible to provide the necessary headroom so that the final audio output won't clip/distort when mixing multiple decks together, applying effects e.t.c.
On the other hand, when using "external (Hardware)" mixer mode, the firmware of the device is responsible for all of the above.
In reality, VirtualDJ (with default mapper and settings) lowers the volume for internal (MIDI) mode so that the overall output volume matches that of analog sources connected at the analog ports of these controllers. Usually that means that for MIDI mixer mode the master volume is set at -6db or -9db depending the unit (that's how much headroom it provides)
On external (hardware) mixer mode, VirtualDJ does not lower the master volume.
So, in order to recap:
The correct way to work with such units is either:
1) Internal (MIDI) mixer mode with 6 to 9 db headroom
2) External (Hardware) mixer mode with "no" headroom
If you use default mappers and settings, there should be no noticeable difference is sound output volume between the two modes.
Finally, NO, it's not advised to "use" those 6 to 9 db headroom of internal mixer mode for "normal playback" in order to make the master output of the unit louder.
The headroom is there in order to ensure that any PEAKS (not RMS values) of the sound won't distort the digital sound interface.
It's how the firmware of those devices work.
So, in a nutshell, when using "internal (MIDI)" mode the software is responsible for the entire range of the sound interface of the device, which also means that the software is responsible to provide the necessary headroom so that the final audio output won't clip/distort when mixing multiple decks together, applying effects e.t.c.
On the other hand, when using "external (Hardware)" mixer mode, the firmware of the device is responsible for all of the above.
In reality, VirtualDJ (with default mapper and settings) lowers the volume for internal (MIDI) mode so that the overall output volume matches that of analog sources connected at the analog ports of these controllers. Usually that means that for MIDI mixer mode the master volume is set at -6db or -9db depending the unit (that's how much headroom it provides)
On external (hardware) mixer mode, VirtualDJ does not lower the master volume.
So, in order to recap:
The correct way to work with such units is either:
1) Internal (MIDI) mixer mode with 6 to 9 db headroom
2) External (Hardware) mixer mode with "no" headroom
If you use default mappers and settings, there should be no noticeable difference is sound output volume between the two modes.
Finally, NO, it's not advised to "use" those 6 to 9 db headroom of internal mixer mode for "normal playback" in order to make the master output of the unit louder.
The headroom is there in order to ensure that any PEAKS (not RMS values) of the sound won't distort the digital sound interface.
Posted Sun 05 Dec 21 @ 3:29 pm
Mr DJ Mel
Thanks for the reply Phantom.
The explanation helps but i think you may have it the wrong way round.
Playing through internal mode - ie. the RX set as MIDI mode in the menu, it is so much louder.
Playing through external mode - i.e. with the RX set as XDJ-RX mode in the menu, it is a lot lower in output.
In each case i have tested using the default mapper and my out is set to 0db in both mode, yet there is a massive difference when using external mode.
Now i know it could just be a Pioneer thing, but was hoping there might be anything in the mappers file that can be changed to stop this behaviour?
I hope that made sense?
Thanks
Mel
The explanation helps but i think you may have it the wrong way round.
Playing through internal mode - ie. the RX set as MIDI mode in the menu, it is so much louder.
Playing through external mode - i.e. with the RX set as XDJ-RX mode in the menu, it is a lot lower in output.
In each case i have tested using the default mapper and my out is set to 0db in both mode, yet there is a massive difference when using external mode.
Now i know it could just be a Pioneer thing, but was hoping there might be anything in the mappers file that can be changed to stop this behaviour?
I hope that made sense?
Thanks
Mel
Posted Tue 07 Dec 21 @ 10:05 am
PhantomDeejay
I was providing a reply in general.
And what I'm saying above makes perfect sense in your case as well.
XDJ-RX plays louder in MIDI mode because that's how firmware works.
Since XDJ-RX was mapped way back, we didn't had the tools at the time to make it lower the volume of MIDI mixer in comparison with hardware mixer and later the case was forgotten.
So effectively XDJ-RX demonstrates exactly what I'm saying. The unit plays about 6db to 9db louder than it should when you use "MIDI" mixer because VirtualDJ sends full signal on it without taking into account that the firmware expects a lower signal.
You can solve the "issue" by changing your "zerodb" setting to -6db or to -9db when you use "MIDI" mode.
That's the same with what happens internally (on definition level) with other units (like RZ) that are mapped to compensate the difference in volume level between the different modes.
And what I'm saying above makes perfect sense in your case as well.
XDJ-RX plays louder in MIDI mode because that's how firmware works.
Since XDJ-RX was mapped way back, we didn't had the tools at the time to make it lower the volume of MIDI mixer in comparison with hardware mixer and later the case was forgotten.
So effectively XDJ-RX demonstrates exactly what I'm saying. The unit plays about 6db to 9db louder than it should when you use "MIDI" mixer because VirtualDJ sends full signal on it without taking into account that the firmware expects a lower signal.
You can solve the "issue" by changing your "zerodb" setting to -6db or to -9db when you use "MIDI" mode.
That's the same with what happens internally (on definition level) with other units (like RZ) that are mapped to compensate the difference in volume level between the different modes.
Posted Tue 07 Dec 21 @ 10:32 am
Mr DJ Mel
Makes perfect sense, thank you.
Posted Tue 07 Dec 21 @ 12:45 pm