Posted Fri 27 Oct 17 @ 1:27 pm
Posted Fri 27 Oct 17 @ 1:27 pm
A Man and His Music
Kenny Speed wrote :
So in that case if someone who buys the touch, then after a while sells it, the software will not be worth keeping.
BUT, should be sold with the controller. This must mean that the licence is transferable, is that allowed?
Should at least be one or the other, either it is tied to the person or the machine?
BUT, should be sold with the controller. This must mean that the licence is transferable, is that allowed?
Should at least be one or the other, either it is tied to the person or the machine?
No, none of the licenses are transferable.
Posted Fri 27 Oct 17 @ 4:40 pm
the SOUND INSURGENT
Corporate staff wrote :
Ok that video has me about sold!
Posted Fri 27 Oct 17 @ 4:47 pm
Kenny Speed
Kenny Speed wrote :
So in that case if someone who buys the touch, then after a while sells it, the software will not be worth keeping.
BUT, should be sold with the controller. This must mean that the licence is transferable, is that allowed?
Should at least be one or the other, either it is tied to the person or the machine?
A man & his music replied:
"No, none of the licenses are transferable."
So, that must mean that if you were to sell the touch second hand, you keep the software that came with it for life, and use it on your next controller, correct?????
So in that case if someone who buys the touch, then after a while sells it, the software will not be worth keeping.
BUT, should be sold with the controller. This must mean that the licence is transferable, is that allowed?
Should at least be one or the other, either it is tied to the person or the machine?
A man & his music replied:
"No, none of the licenses are transferable."
So, that must mean that if you were to sell the touch second hand, you keep the software that came with it for life, and use it on your next controller, correct?????
Posted Fri 27 Oct 17 @ 10:01 pm
kradcliffe
My understanding is that the Pro license supplied will work as normal, however it needs the touch to connect "now and again" to validate the license. So if you sell the controller and one day that Pro license won't work any more (at some unknown point). You also can't transfer ownership of it so it effectively dies and you would need to buy full Pro all over again for your next controller. Also the person buying the touch would also need a full Pro license to use it.
A bit messy.
Please feel free to correct me if this isn't the case.
A bit messy.
Please feel free to correct me if this isn't the case.
Posted Sat 28 Oct 17 @ 2:41 am
Kenny Speed
If that is the case, it sux!
As if VDJ is not expensive enough already, with out it potentially becoming useless.
As if VDJ is not expensive enough already, with out it potentially becoming useless.
Posted Sat 28 Oct 17 @ 3:21 am
groovindj
Kenny, if you really want to be sure about how the license for the Touch version of VDJ works, then you should speak to a member of staff (i.e. djdad).
Keith is being pessimistic and assuming certain things. Babis (djdad) has already said that it's a full Pro Infinity license.
It's fair enough that it would check for the Touch when being installed. Even for a certain amount of time afterwards. I'd imagine that you wouldn't be selling the Touch for a while.
Remember that the VDJ 8 licenses are registered here, to your username & account, so Atomix know which license you have, how long you've had it, which controller you have, when you logged in etc.
If you did find that the license "locked you out" after you'd sold your controller, Atomix would be able to help you (if that situation ever arose anyway).
Keith is being pessimistic and assuming certain things. Babis (djdad) has already said that it's a full Pro Infinity license.
It's fair enough that it would check for the Touch when being installed. Even for a certain amount of time afterwards. I'd imagine that you wouldn't be selling the Touch for a while.
Remember that the VDJ 8 licenses are registered here, to your username & account, so Atomix know which license you have, how long you've had it, which controller you have, when you logged in etc.
If you did find that the license "locked you out" after you'd sold your controller, Atomix would be able to help you (if that situation ever arose anyway).
Posted Sat 28 Oct 17 @ 8:44 am
Support staff
It seems to be a lot of discussion and confusion about the PRO OEM license that comes with the Reloop Touch unit.
So, to clarify this:
- a PRO OEM license, as long as it's active, has ALL THE SAME FEATURES as a PRO INFINITY or a PRO MONTHLY license.
- a PRO OEM license is only valid as long as you still own (and regularly use) the controller it came with.
- a PRO OEM license cannot be sold or transferred to someone else once it has been activated (neither can PRO INFINITY/MONTHLY for that matter). It's linked to your personal email. EDIT: this is not true anymore
- a PRO OEM license needs to be activated with a one-time-use serial code that you can find inside the controller box.
the PRO OEM license can be used without the controller connected (so you can use it at home to prepare your mix).
It can also be used with any other controllers from other brands.
But it needs to "see" a Reloop Touch connected once in a while.
I hope this makes things more clear for everybody.
EDIT: "once in a while" means long enough that you don't have to worry. you can definitely go to a club and use your PRO OEM license to perform on other controllers without worrying about "did I use the Reloop Touch recently enough?". But if you sold your Touch 6 months ago, then yes, it's not going to work. But you'll get many advance warnings.
EDIT 2017-10-08: Due to all the valid points raised in this thread, we changed the policy. PRO OEM licenses are now transferable, and will be passed to the new owner if you sell your Reloop Touch
Posted Sat 28 Oct 17 @ 3:52 pm
kradcliffe
Brilliant. Thanks for the clarification.
Posted Sat 28 Oct 17 @ 6:38 pm
Kenny Speed
Thanks for the clarification on the licence there TEAMER.
Now let me say how your statement makes me feel as a consumer.
It's not fair, I feel Atomix is beeing greedy. I also feel you haven't given this due consideration.
Now let me explain why I feel that way.
On both the Reloop web site and VDJ web site there is no mention of an "Pro OEM Licence", it as if you have just made this up off the cuff?
Nowhere in the EULA is there a mention of "Pro OEM Licence", I know because I have studied it.
In all advertising on line it is reported that the Touch comes with the "FULL Pro version of VDJ8", which according to your web site and has no limitation in regard to length of time it remains valid for, being and I quote, "without any expiration". No caveats that it needs to plugged in once in a while to a particular controller.
As also quoted below we pay for the right, limited to the use of the software, "without any expiration". But not to own it.
"2. OWNERSHIP
The license only gives you limited rights to USE the Software. "
The cost of that is built in to the price of the controller, which I as a consumer would have paid for in full if if I'd have bought that controller / software package.
Consider this Teamer, I buy the Touch, then after lets say for example a year later I want to change controllers, not happy with it, but love the software. The package cost me $899 AUD. Now being second hand it is generally worth 50% of what I paid for it. $450 AUD. But I can't transfer the licence to a new owner, so with out the software which will cost the new owner $400 AUD, it's real value becomes $50 AUD.
Now if I sell it for $50, I have lost $849 AUD, in this example over a year. But it gets worse because I can't keep using the licence if what you say is true TEAMER. Meaning I would have to purchase another VDJ8 Pro licence, which is supposed to be,"without any expiration". This will then cost me another $400 AUD, making the total cost to date to be $1249, all I have to show for the is the software licence I just re-purchased, that's on top of whatever the cost of a new controller is.
*************See what you are doing? You are making both the controller and software worthless to your customers that want to swap controllers, if it comes as a so called "OEM Version", as described in TEAMER's post.******************
Atomix should really consider that carefully!
But if I can, which according to my study of the Reloop & VDJ advertising and the EULA on the VDJ web site, I can. Keep the software, "without any expiration", without needing to be plugged into the touch at any time. Then I am able to retain some worthwhile value from the original purchase.
I have also studied your opposition, Serato DJ and Traktor Pro. Both of which give their customers 2 options:
1. The original owner retains the use of the software if they sell the controller.
2. They allow the transfer of licences to the new owner once the original owner uninstalls the software and removes it from his account. (may also need a receipt as proof of the sale). The original owner is then provided with a transfer key to give to the new owner).
And both of these programs are considerably cheaper for me to buy, at around half the price of VDJ8.
(Understand that with VDJ8, I would be paying for video which I don't need, optional in Serato).
So I don't understand why you too don't offer the same options, as I think it is only fair to do so, having already paid for the right to use VDJ8 "without any expiration".
I hope this has given Atomix some food for thought, and help you to see the perspective of this consumer.
I look forward to your thoughtful response.
Regards,
Ken.
Now let me say how your statement makes me feel as a consumer.
It's not fair, I feel Atomix is beeing greedy. I also feel you haven't given this due consideration.
Now let me explain why I feel that way.
On both the Reloop web site and VDJ web site there is no mention of an "Pro OEM Licence", it as if you have just made this up off the cuff?
Nowhere in the EULA is there a mention of "Pro OEM Licence", I know because I have studied it.
In all advertising on line it is reported that the Touch comes with the "FULL Pro version of VDJ8", which according to your web site and has no limitation in regard to length of time it remains valid for, being and I quote, "without any expiration". No caveats that it needs to plugged in once in a while to a particular controller.
As also quoted below we pay for the right, limited to the use of the software, "without any expiration". But not to own it.
"2. OWNERSHIP
The license only gives you limited rights to USE the Software. "
The cost of that is built in to the price of the controller, which I as a consumer would have paid for in full if if I'd have bought that controller / software package.
Consider this Teamer, I buy the Touch, then after lets say for example a year later I want to change controllers, not happy with it, but love the software. The package cost me $899 AUD. Now being second hand it is generally worth 50% of what I paid for it. $450 AUD. But I can't transfer the licence to a new owner, so with out the software which will cost the new owner $400 AUD, it's real value becomes $50 AUD.
Now if I sell it for $50, I have lost $849 AUD, in this example over a year. But it gets worse because I can't keep using the licence if what you say is true TEAMER. Meaning I would have to purchase another VDJ8 Pro licence, which is supposed to be,"without any expiration". This will then cost me another $400 AUD, making the total cost to date to be $1249, all I have to show for the is the software licence I just re-purchased, that's on top of whatever the cost of a new controller is.
*************See what you are doing? You are making both the controller and software worthless to your customers that want to swap controllers, if it comes as a so called "OEM Version", as described in TEAMER's post.******************
Atomix should really consider that carefully!
But if I can, which according to my study of the Reloop & VDJ advertising and the EULA on the VDJ web site, I can. Keep the software, "without any expiration", without needing to be plugged into the touch at any time. Then I am able to retain some worthwhile value from the original purchase.
I have also studied your opposition, Serato DJ and Traktor Pro. Both of which give their customers 2 options:
1. The original owner retains the use of the software if they sell the controller.
2. They allow the transfer of licences to the new owner once the original owner uninstalls the software and removes it from his account. (may also need a receipt as proof of the sale). The original owner is then provided with a transfer key to give to the new owner).
And both of these programs are considerably cheaper for me to buy, at around half the price of VDJ8.
(Understand that with VDJ8, I would be paying for video which I don't need, optional in Serato).
So I don't understand why you too don't offer the same options, as I think it is only fair to do so, having already paid for the right to use VDJ8 "without any expiration".
I hope this has given Atomix some food for thought, and help you to see the perspective of this consumer.
I look forward to your thoughtful response.
Regards,
Ken.
Posted Sun 29 Oct 17 @ 12:00 am
wildcountryclub
Kenny - simple solution. buy a full pro infinity license and then just never worry about what controller you get again because any that are supported by the company will be available for use with the software.
and no, it's NOT that expense.
'expensive enough as it is" indeed...
and no, it's NOT that expense.
'expensive enough as it is" indeed...
Posted Sun 29 Oct 17 @ 9:14 pm
A Man and His Music
Life is not fair, but we go on.
Posted Sun 29 Oct 17 @ 11:48 pm
dwelly
I have serato (£45 on sale week) and traktor (multiple licences included with my X1 and Z1 controllers purchased 2nd hand with licences transferred) but I choose to use Virtual DJ exclusively (Pro Inifnity).
I regularly use a Numark NV and know that if I sell it the new user can use serato. I would not consider purchasing a reloop touch if the software licence cannot be transferred if I choose to sell it.
From the Reloop Touch registration page http://www.virtualdj.com/reloop/
"Note This license and keycode cannot be sold or transfered to someone who does not own a Reloop Touch"
The implication on the registration page (and the most sensible option) is that this "Pro OEM" licence can be transferred to the new owner of the hardware?
I regularly use a Numark NV and know that if I sell it the new user can use serato. I would not consider purchasing a reloop touch if the software licence cannot be transferred if I choose to sell it.
From the Reloop Touch registration page http://www.virtualdj.com/reloop/
"Note This license and keycode cannot be sold or transfered to someone who does not own a Reloop Touch"
The implication on the registration page (and the most sensible option) is that this "Pro OEM" licence can be transferred to the new owner of the hardware?
Posted Mon 30 Oct 17 @ 1:07 pm
Kenny Speed
Thanks for pointing this out dwelly.
From the Reloop Touch registration page http://www.virtualdj.com/reloop/
"Note This license and keycode cannot be sold or transfered to someone who does not own a Reloop Touch"
It would seem that in this case then, that you can sell the touch and transfer the licence to the new owner?
If this is 100% right, then I would be happy enough with that.
From the Reloop Touch registration page http://www.virtualdj.com/reloop/
"Note This license and keycode cannot be sold or transfered to someone who does not own a Reloop Touch"
It would seem that in this case then, that you can sell the touch and transfer the licence to the new owner?
If this is 100% right, then I would be happy enough with that.
Posted Mon 30 Oct 17 @ 8:40 pm
Support staff
"When Reloop announced their VirtualDJ powered TOUCH controller, my attention was grabbed… We managed to spend a little time with it at BPM 2017, enough to know that our interest was completely justified. ..it’s amazing in practice!" - DJWORX
https://djworx.com/a-brief-play-with-the-reloop-touch/
https://djworx.com/a-brief-play-with-the-reloop-touch/
Posted Mon 30 Oct 17 @ 9:06 pm
hrdnx
And the world goes on. You win some, You lose some
Kenny maybe you should also look at Rekordbox. Controllers come with this installed.
(somebody say "can of worms"??)
Kenny maybe you should also look at Rekordbox. Controllers come with this installed.
(somebody say "can of worms"??)
Posted Mon 30 Oct 17 @ 9:40 pm
A Man and His Music
@Kenny Speed, your long post is without merit. An educated consumer does not try to compare products that are not comparable. You can't compare the price of VirtualDJ to the price of the other software's. They are not in the same class. VirtualDJ gives you everything for one price. So simply, there is no comparison. Unless you would also like to compare the price of a E class Mercedes with the S class Mercedes. See how silly that is? No comparison, and they are made by the same company. Just because they are competitors, does not mean they are comparable. You may compare some of the features, but not the whole product, unless they have the exact same features. Get it?
You would also like VirtualDJ to have the same exact policies as their competitors. Really? If you look at all the DJs contracts on this forum, you will note they we all do not think alike. That's like a potential client saying to me that "Joey DJ will give me my deposit back, if I cancel the party." Well I say, "You should hire Joey DJ, because it clearly states that if you cancel the date, refund is non refundable." See how simple that is? What other competitive companies do you know that have the same policies? Please, let's try to be realistic and leave the fantasy stuff to the movies. I like the movies, and go almost every Tuesday.
You would also like VirtualDJ to have the same exact policies as their competitors. Really? If you look at all the DJs contracts on this forum, you will note they we all do not think alike. That's like a potential client saying to me that "Joey DJ will give me my deposit back, if I cancel the party." Well I say, "You should hire Joey DJ, because it clearly states that if you cancel the date, refund is non refundable." See how simple that is? What other competitive companies do you know that have the same policies? Please, let's try to be realistic and leave the fantasy stuff to the movies. I like the movies, and go almost every Tuesday.
Posted Mon 30 Oct 17 @ 9:51 pm
groovindj
Kenny Speed wrote :
transfer the licence to the new owner
No. VDJ licenses are not transferable. It's clearly stated on the price and licenses page.
"please note that all VirtualDJ licenses are not transferable. Once purchased, they are associated with your personal email, and cannot be sold or transfered to someone else."
Posted Mon 30 Oct 17 @ 10:00 pm
dwelly
I don't expect VDJ licences to match the other software but with the others there is absolute clarity.
My Numark NV unlocks full serato DJ as do my Numark V7s but in order to use my Reloop Terminal Mix 4 with full serato I had to purchase a licence which I did for £45 (in sale week).
My friend is a serato user but is looking for a 4 channel controller and considered switching to virtual dj with the Reloop Touch. But he held off pre-ordering when he found out that due to the licencing he may have trouble reselling if he doesn't get along with it.
Virtual DJ already has a hard enough time against Serato, Traktor & Rekordbox on price and consumer perception, justified or not, that issues like this need to be resolved especially if we are to see more of these "bundled with hardware deals".
My Numark NV unlocks full serato DJ as do my Numark V7s but in order to use my Reloop Terminal Mix 4 with full serato I had to purchase a licence which I did for £45 (in sale week).
My friend is a serato user but is looking for a 4 channel controller and considered switching to virtual dj with the Reloop Touch. But he held off pre-ordering when he found out that due to the licencing he may have trouble reselling if he doesn't get along with it.
Virtual DJ already has a hard enough time against Serato, Traktor & Rekordbox on price and consumer perception, justified or not, that issues like this need to be resolved especially if we are to see more of these "bundled with hardware deals".
Posted Tue 31 Oct 17 @ 4:30 pm
the SOUND INSURGENT
So do you actually have to register the software on the website?? I mean can't you just type in the serial number that comes with the unit??
Posted Tue 31 Oct 17 @ 4:36 pm
